Rakuten CMO Dana Marineau on How to Earn a Cart Full of Fans
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Earning a Cart Full of Fans
Over the last two years, we’ve seen shopping change a lot; being forced out of stores similarly forced brands to think harder and faster about how to create better digital experiences and partnerships, and new ways to showcase their products. Now that COVID seems to be on the decline, consumers continue to demand high-quality e-commerce experiences, a demand that companies like Rakuten are working to meet.
Rakuten Rewards is an online shopping platform that gives you cash back at your favorite stores. Dana has been with Rakuten for almost 2 years and brings with her a wealth of knowledge and experience in the marketing space.
Connect with Dana Marineau on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/danamarineau/
Read more about Rakuten: https://www.rakuten.ca/
Full episode here:
FULL TRANSCRIPT BELOW
Adam Conner (00:09):
Today on The Future of Fandom, earn some cash with me! Or earn some back, anyway. My name’s Adam Conner, I’m your host. And on this episode, we go shopping with Rakuten to learn about might be on the horizon for online and in-store shoppers alike via their Chief Marketing Officer Dana Marineau. Obviously over the last two years, we’ve seen shopping change a lot, being forced out of stores similarly, forced brands to think harder and fast about how to create better digital experiences, partnerships, and new way a to showcase product. Now that COVID seems to be on the decline, consumers continue to demand high-quality e- (and now hybrid) commerce. Dana’s on the cutting edge there and has plenty to teach us about what to expect for best in class shopping. So fill your cart and we will start to predict the future with Rakuten and Dana Marineau. Dana, how are you? Thanks so much for joining me.
Dana Marineau (01:10):
Adam, it’s great to talk to you again. Thanks for having me.
Adam Conner (01:13):
I can’t wait to chat with you again. I love chat with you on podcasts and listeners, prior to the life of The Future of Fandom, I did interview Dana a few times in this world, so this is going to be a nice familiar conversation to have. And one which is, of course, with a well known, recognized, and still growing leader in e-commerce a pioneer in some ways, but now we’re going to be talking about how trails will continue to be blazed in the namesake future of the show. First off, and not that people don’t know what this is, can we just do a very, very basic what the heck is Rakuten and what does it provide just in case everybody’s not familiar? And then we’ll talk about e-buying and what these past two years have done and go from there.
Dana Marineau (01:57):
Of course. So, yes, Rakuten. You may have heard of Rakuten and it is a very large company in Japan, but here in the U.S., it is newer to some folks. So I will say, Adam, Rakuten is an online shopping platform that gives you cashback at your favorite stores, your favorite brands. So we have over 3,500 stores, everything from Nike, to Old Navy, to Neiman Marcus, to Expedia, you name it, we probably have it. And every time you buy online through Rakuten, you get cash back on that purchase. So we think it’s a way for people to feel like they’re winning every time they shop.
Adam Conner (02:31):
And listeners, if you watched the Super Bowl, you will have seen their most recent high profile spot, featuring Hannah Waddingham who was on Ted Lasso at a very high stakes poker game, where some interesting chips were used, if I’m recalling correctly, pairs of shoes and microwaves. And what the heck was that? Dana, you had a hand in that. Didn’t you putting all that together?
Dana Marineau (02:50):
We did. Thank you. Yes. Very proud of that campaign. And Adam, I think, as we’ve talked about before, we’ve built an in-house brand and creative team. So we built that whole thing in house and, yes, instead of poker chips, it was an i-robot, and a little i-vacuum, a television and a pair of shoes that Hannah Waddingham, by the way, she is incredible, from Ted Lasso, was playing against a savvy Rakuten shopper, who, of course beat Hannah, because she shopped all those things with Rakuten and got a lot of money and cash back. But thank you for mentioning that. We’re very proud.
Adam Conner (03:25):
Of course, it’s a good intro too, because doesn’t it really set the scene for what the last several years has done to the e-buying experience. Though the field has been leveled in a way, and you can get access to goods that you get cash back for that you never could before, which maybe makes you feel like you deserve a seat at that high-stakes table. Over the last two years, obviously, lots of digital trends have been pulled forward. We’ve heard that ad nauseam, but since you are in the e-commerce world and seen that first hand, what, in your perspective, has it done for, shall we say, the present of the digital shopping experience. What COVID did to e-buying, truly buying, not just, “Hey, I’ll look at it online and then I’ll go to the store,” because you couldn’t do that. In what ways were your hands forced? And did it help?
Dana Marineau (04:15):
Excellent question. And, yeah, something we have been thinking about at Rakuten, certainly COVID, the pandemic has been eye opening in a lot of ways about the way people shop, how people shop, when people shop. And as you said, we have read a lot about the pandemic fueling e-commerce. Now I will say part of that is, as you remember, the first six, nine months or so, people were not going into stores. So that in its self was an interesting and different dynamic. Everyone was forced to buy nearly everything, from clothes to sunglasses, to toilet paper, online. So that of course changes the dynamic. One of the things I think has been very eye opening to us around how retailers and merchants are balancing what I would’ve called sort of a hybrid approach now. People are going back into stores. People are comfortable going into a shop now.
Dana Marineau (05:08):
So, but, as you said, e-commerce really blew up and people have become used to buying online. So what I think is interesting and I would even put the analogy of getting people returning to the office, this hybrid approach, “Some days I’m in the office, some days at home.” I’d say the same thing about online-buying and e-commerce is there’s a hybrid thing happening. “Sometimes I go in the store, sometimes I buy online,” but there’s also this new, “Hey, I want to buy it online. I’ve enjoyed that experience for all the reasons, the convenience, et cetera. But I need that instant gratification of what it feels like when I go into a store.”
Dana Marineau (05:46):
So there’s this hybrid thing happening now, too, that a lot of our partners and retailers have been testing, which is this concept of buy it online and then pick it up in the store or buy it online and now we partner with DoorDash or Uber Eats, so that it can get to you right away. So there’s just been this interesting shift in, again, I call it sort of a hybrid of the good experience of the in-store, the bad experience of the in-store, the good experience, the bad experience of online, just it out to see what people really want and how to make the best possible shopping experience, whether it’s physically in the store, or online, or some hybrid of those two things.
Adam Conner (06:30):
And I expect you and Rakuten having built for… not obviously having built for a pandemic where it be forced, but built for a future of that, where people would have their hybrid options or their purist options in either channel. I’m sure that somewhere in your head, you thought, “Well, I know that people are going to like this,” but maybe the reasons they’re in some of you expected and some of you didn’t. When it came to or when it comes to how consumers are getting value out of either Rakuten or the e-shopping experience, what’s been most unexpected?
Dana Marineau (07:02):
Well, I would say about Rakuten, you’re definitely right that we try to give you the best possible shopping experience, no matter how you’re shopping.
“To your point, whether you buy online and we give you that very winning, satisfactory feeling of the cashback, or you go into the store and you’re a member of Rakuten, so you still get that in-store cashback. You’re right to say, we have been prepared for a moment like this. However, you’re going to shop, make sure you do it through Rakuten, so you get that cashback and that winning feeling. I think the from unexpected is I, person, have been testing out myself. This concept of, ‘I don’t have time to go to the store, but I need this thing right now.’ So testing out some of these hybrid options, sometimes they work, sometimes they don’t.”
— Dana Marineau (7:04)
Dana Marineau (07:49):
I’ve been surprised by how many people have tried this buy online, pick it up in store or, “Hey, I’m going to trust Walgreens to partner with DoorDash and get me that thing immediately.” So I’ve been surprised to see how many people have adopted that, how many retailers have adopted that and to see that people really are enjoying this hybrid approach. And I guess I would say the concept of hybrid is a shock. If you had asked me two years ago, would I imagine a day where I didn’t go to my office every single day, that some days I worked from home, I would’ve said, “Adam, are you insane? Of course not.” Same with this. I didn’t really imagine a day where you could shop online and then get it that second. That was definitely not something I anticipated myself.
Adam Conner (08:33):
Yeah. For me, and I’m not a business operator myself, but I’m just thinking about all the logistical nightmares that go into linking these disparate entities into a partnership that, ultimately, gets the whatever it is from the retailer to the delivery partner and is there an online experience as part of that just seems like a complete spiderweb, which I guess we were forced into weaving, but one which it was a bit unexpected to me just is like how quickly everybody came together. And all of a sudden things that I would’ve assumed were roadblocks were lifted in light of this new environment. And, of course, all to the benefit of shoppers, yourself included. And just for the record here, I believe all of your shopping is done through Rakuten. You’re really drinking the Kool-Aid there.
Dana Marineau (09:15):
You know that’s right, Adam. I refuse to buy anything unless I can get it on Rakuten and get my cash back. So I am hardcore Rakuten shopper. It is true. I will go out of my way to only shop at Rakuten. And, honestly, I love it. And I am a big fan, of course, of Rakuten and getting that cash back, I’m kind of addicted to it. But, yes, I only shop with Rakuten. That is for sure true, because there isn’t anything we don’t have that I need. That is just true.
Adam Conner (09:41):
Sure. And I love the idea of getting cashback anywhere. In fact, you mentioned something here that I’m going to ask about again in a little bit, that in-store cashback, because I think there’s a bit of education that you’ll have to give to me here just because it’s a slightly new-ish concept in my ears. So I’m not the most sophisticated shopper. My idea of a hybrid shopping experience is what I was thinking when a couple of years ago, I went on a few year run of going out to shop on Black Friday. Now I would not get in the line and wait in the JCPenney for the pair of pants or whatever it was. I would walk around the store. I would see the thing that I liked. And then I just go online to their site and buy it without having to wait in the line, any ad will show up before Christmas, whatever that’s as far as I go.
Adam Conner (10:22):
So I’m glad to be able to learn a little bit more about these specific intricacies, which I’ll ask you in a second, because I first want to go to the side of the buyer, the side of the me who is getting more sophisticated each and every day, specifically within the filter of fandom. Now fandom, a word that everybody on this podcast, everybody listening to this might associate traditionally with sport. I’m a fan of a team, a player, a thing. And I think eventually people will become genuine fans and diehards of brands. That’s what this show is all about. And so there are parallels in business that are to be discussed. And I think when you talk about retailers and providers of good manufacturers, things like that.
Adam Conner (11:01):
It’s almost in my head, and it’ll be in your too, because we prepped for this, being a fan of a team, which is maybe like where the retailer is that you buy the thing from, and the player, which is the good that you buy within that. I think I have that correct. Do you see any parallels there in how people shop based on either the brands or the banners that they love the most?
Dana Marineau (11:28):
Yes. And I do love this analogy and I think, Adam, you also know I’m a huge sports fan, so this will be fun for both of us.
Adam Conner (11:35):
I assumed as much.
“When I think of being a fan, I think you can be a fan of a team. I am a huge Warriors fan, obviously. And just like I’m also a huge fan of certain brands. I love Nike. I love Bloomingdale’s. There’s also the concept of “I can love the Warriors, but maybe I’m really just a fan of Steph Curry, the player on the Warriors.” And using that same analogy, I love Nike. I said that, but I also collect Air Jordans. So the thing that I just think is very interesting about this analogy is I think shopping with Rakuten or shopping online, in general, is a lot like this. I can collect Air Jordans. I can buy those Air Jordans from Nike, or I could buy them from StockX or I could buy them from Finish Line.”
— Dana Marineau (11:36)
Dana Marineau (12:22):
It’s the same idea of “I can love the Warriors or I can love the players on the Warriors.” I think Rakuten provides you the ability to be a fan either of the store or the item that you’re trying to buy from many stores. And that’s actually how we encourage our members to buy from Rakuten actually is “Is it you love this particular store or is it you want this product? Let me show you all the stores Rakuten has and the cash back rates at each of those stores. And that way you’re still getting that product you wanted, but look to compare who has the better cash back rate?” Is it Nike? Is it Finish Line? Is it Footlocker? Is it StockX? So I think that’s a really interesting way to think about buyers and what is it that they’re a fan of? Is it that they’re loyal to this one store or no, they just want this one thing. It doesn’t matter where they buy it, as long as they get that exact thing. So I love that analogy. I think it’s very true.
Adam Conner (13:18):
And maybe it’s a third thing in the middle. Now I’m going to go into the basketball… I’m not as massive a fan of basketball as you are, but I’m thinking there’s got to be the fan that says, Well, I like the Warriors and I like Steph and some days I’ll prefer… Regardless of the team of the player, or a certain player, or a certain team, but really what I like is good basketball. And in this case, really what I like is the cash back. If I’m going to get the most utility from a certain place, maybe that is what drives me more than anything else. But regardless of the metric that people go after, whether it be the banner, or the brand, or the incentive, how does the experience, and I will speak to Rakuten specifically here, how does the experience get differentiated when you approach different consumers who select those types of preferences? I’m sure that it modifies in some way, but I just am curious, because, hey, personalization, differentiation, that’s all pointed at the future. And I’d be curious to know how you handle it.
“We definitely do our best at Rakuten to personalize your home feed experience. Meaning when you first sign up with Rakuten, we will ask you, ‘Hey, tell us about the things you shop for. Like do you have pets? Do you have kids? Do you shop for apparel? Do you shop for airline tickets?’ So we’ll ask you those questions. And then if you click ‘I shop for travel. I shop for shoes. I have a kid, so I shop for soccer cleats,’ then we’ll say, ‘Great, thank you for telling us that. Here are all sorts of stores that we can offer to you. Do you happen to like any of these stores?’ And you say, ‘Oh, yes. Actually I like Under Armour. I like Bloomingdale’s. I like Expedia,’ whatever it is. And then when you get to your home feed, your homepage of Rakuten, we will show you the stores that you’ve selected or stores like the ones you’ve selected and you can see the cashback rates.”
— Dana Marineau (14:14)
Dana Marineau (15:05):
And we do our best to personalize that experience fair. So that we say, “Hey, I know you told us. You liked Nike, but by the way, Adidas is on 12% cashback today.” So I think answering your question, what we want to do is give you the best possible shopping experience, whether it is, “I love Adidas,” or “No, no, I just need to buy new cleats for my son and I see that this brand has a higher cashback rate today. Oh, and by the way, is having a free friends and family sale too. I should go there.” So to your point, fandom really does evolve. And I think there are people who actually just want the highest cashback rate. They don’t care what store they’re-buying or what even brand they’re-buying it’s that they want the highest return. So there are definitely people like that. And then there are people who are like, “No, no, no. I only buy from Nike.” So I do think do our best at Rakuten to personalize that experience and give you what you need based on what we know about you.
Adam Conner (15:57):
And listeners, that was not a verbal typo there. When you think about making cashback on purchases, you might think of something like a credit card, which offers 1 or 2%, but Dana said 12. That is not an anomaly. If you don’t know what Rakuten is, that’s the kind of thing that you can look forward to. So maybe we just made a Fanny it just out of that, because we’re in the heck else are you’re going to get 12% off of a purchase like that, especially made online?
Dana Marineau (16:19):
Oh, and Adam, I’ll just say many times a year, we go above that 12%. Certainly, for our big give event in may, we have many, many hundreds of stores at 15%, for many days. Over the holidays, Black Fridays, Cyber Monday, we have hundreds of stores at 15, sometimes even 20%. So we have some big deal days that are really high. And sometimes we even have days where we call it super app Sunday, where we get a very high percentage across lots of stores, only if you buy in the app. So we try to do our best to make for some special days.
Adam Conner (16:52):
So listeners, if you’re not downloading it, you should at this point, all right, because you’re missing out. And we’ll touch on this a bit further, because obviously, in regard to the way that any fandom will grow, we got to also assess the state of it today. So I have a few questions about where you see it right now today and we’ll keep it Rakuten specific again. I mentioned I would talk about in-store cashback later on and we’re near that moment now, but first I’ll ask over the last couple of years, there are different sects, as you’ve said, of consumers who prefer the, like you, prefer a certain store, maybe prefer the cashback. Have you seen those trends changing at all? Or what’s popular nowadays? Is it more fandom of a banner or a brand or utility? What have you seen?
Dana Marineau (17:36):
I would say what we’re looking at in terms of trends is less about what you’re asking about and more about genres and what people are-buying and not buying. So I’ll give you an example. Of course, you’ve seen all the press coverage on the last two years athleisure home office, home improvement, casual yoga pants, sneakers. Oh and by the way, of course, pets and pet supplies. There are things that people were-buying in store and online that sort of took a huge swing over the let’s call it two years of the pandemic and lockdown and quarantine and where people were just mostly staying home. What I will tell you is there’s been a huge shift back to two things. People are starting to travel again, so we’re starting to see a big uptick in our travel properties, whether it’s hotels and planes and car rental.
Dana Marineau (18:34):
And we’re seeing a lot more activity happening in travel again, which of course for nearly two years, we didn’t see much at all. We’re also seeing a lot more purchasing of things people are going out again. They’re going to parties, they’re going back to the office. They’re going to dinner with friends. So we’re seeing a lot more purchases happen in whether it’s the luxury buying and “I’m going to buy a nice new pair of heels or a nice blazer, because I haven’t been to my office in two years.” And again, travel like things, people are leaving the house and we’re starting to see that shift again, away from the athleisure and the home improvement. So when comes to trends, we’re definitely seeing those things happen.
Adam Conner (19:13):
Okay. So we are seeing trends more in categories than in a type of purchase, but even in the ways that people buy, there are new features on the rise. Let me ask about that in-store cashback. So let me get this straight. So I can use Rakuten to buy something, which is an e-buying experience, but I can get cash back in the store. Could you explain that to me?
Dana Marineau (19:33):
Of course. So we are happy for you to shop on any Rakuten retailer or merchant, whether it’s online or, of course, in the store. So for example, when you go into a Macy’s, or you go into a Men’s Warehouse, or you go into Finish Line or Adidas, if you have a Rakuten account that is linked to your credit card and you use that credit card at the store, again, Macy’s, Finish Line, Adidas, you will automatically get your cash back. It is actually as easy as I just said, you have to be a Rakuten member and you have to have your credit card linked, you use that same credit card and you get the cash back. It is awesome.
Adam Conner (20:09):
I got to tell my wife about that Macy’s thing. Macy’s is a good look at the bill at the end of the month. It’s a lot of Macy’s there. So I’ll have to do that.
Dana Marineau (20:16):
So you’ve got to get that cash back, Adam.
Adam Conner (20:19):
Yeah. And I guess that should have been obvious from the beginning. It’s like, “Hey, why should I be forced to choose the platform where I do it? If everybody is partnered and agreeing on the same thing, if I make a buy online, why shouldn’t that link to something that I could then go in the store and get the same benefit, especially if I’m the type of consumer that likes to go into the store, try on the thing, look at the thing, see the selection of items there? And maybe, hey, maybe I see something there and it’s a retailer partner with Rakuten that I didn’t know that I wanted, but, I find it that’s a great cross-sell, upsell opportunity there. So good for the business and, hey, also good for the consumer.
Dana Marineau (20:52):
That’s right. And you hit on the thing that we hope for, which is that discovery. So both online and in store, we hope that, “Hey, you’re going to Rakuten because you know we have Macy’s.” “I’m going to shop around, I’m going to buy the thing and I’m going to get my cash back. Oh, wow. Rakuten also has Sunglass Hut. Oh, Rakuten also has Expedia. Oh wow. Rakuten also has Ann Taylor.” Whatever it is, we want you to be able to discover that both in the mall and online.
Adam Conner (21:20):
I think that makes complete sense. And hopefully listeners, you’ll do some discovering of your own as you continue to peer in to this capability. And I’m sure you’ll be a fan of it right quick. And to that, in terms of what will happen, let me touch on the other F where we focus on the show here on, which is future. I want to ask as we begin to round out today, and then at the very end, I’m going to ask a question, which I believe I’ve asked you before, but not for this audience. Let’s speculate a bit. Let’s peer into the crystal ball, five-ish years down the road, let’s say. And based on what you are seeing now in the market with what retailers are doing, or certain loyalty programs, or whatever, what would a great future state of shopping look like? What can consumers, or should they, expect from the retailers and the brands that they love?
Dana Marineau (22:11):
Okay, great question. I’m going to address it…
Adam Conner (22:13):
Big question too, by the way.
Dana Marineau (22:13):
… through macro sort of online shopping, and then I’ll talk about Rakuten. So I would say what consumers, you used the word expect, and I’m going to use the word demand.
Adam Conner (22:25):
Hey, fair enough. Let’s do that. They’ve demanded a lot after these last two years. So let’s do it.
“Consumers demand options. So what I will say to you is I think a lot of retailers and merchants are playing catch up right now, when it comes to giving consumers as many options as possible as relates to buying. So, again, buying online, buying in store, buying hybrid, you shop for it online, and then you receive it quickly, instant gratification, via a partner that they have, whether it be a DoorDash type thing, an Uber Eats type thing, a shipped delivery, whatever it is. I think you’re going to start seeing people demand that and only shop in places where they have choices and options. So I definitely, asking about crystal ball, I think we certain stores and certain merchants got there faster, quicker during the pandemic. Not everyone is there yet. So I just experienced the other day for the first time I needed something from Walgreens. I didn’t have time to go to the store, but I also needed it that day. So buying it online and having shipped to me and getting it three days later, not an option for me. And it turned out they had an option with DoorDash. Brand new, and I got it in an hour.”
— Dana Marineau (22:30)
Dana Marineau (23:35):
So I think stores are going to have to start adopting all these things in order to, and I’m getting to your second part, the loyalty. People will be loyal to the convenience of shopping. And they’re going to want to shop in all three of those ways. Now with Rakuten, I would say you should only do your online shopping and your in-store shopping in places where you get that cash back. I’m not sure why you would buy anything and not get that cash back reward in return. So we are building, what I would say, is a very loyal member base where people expect from us and our partners that they have a variety of ways to shop with, again, online, in store, or some sort of hybrid.
Dana Marineau (24:12):
So speaking of Rakuten in the future, I would say what we are working on is what I would call exclusive experiences. So you shop with Rakuten and you get something exclusive that you can only get if you shop through Rakuten. And to me, right now, that thing that you get is cash back. I am hopeful that we can start introducing other exclusivities and other experiences as a Rakuten member that you only get when you buy through us. So that’s what I would say, is people are really just trying to give options and give exclusivities for that loyal membership.
Adam Conner (24:46):
I hope you come up with that too, because, again… And it’s in the same vein. I think about other ways in which I would traditionally associate cash back on a purchase. I go back to the credit card thing. This is something that credit card company’s been doing for a long, long, long time. They’ve also only in really one case have done the add-on value of experiences or things exclusive through. Listeners, you have a credit card somewhere in your wallet where somewhere that bank is saying that, but do you really use it? Do you use it that much? I think that exclusive experience world is yet to be disturbed. I don’t know about disrupted because it started, but disturbed for sure, by somebody with this sort of powerful marketplace, like you do.
Adam Conner (25:29):
So I’m really interested to see what you do with that, Dana, genuinely, even outside of this podcast. And listeners, you should expect that and maybe even demand it in the next couple of years from somebody. I don’t know who it is, but, hey, if it’s Rakuten, that’s great. Let me round out with a question that, and this is especially going to help for the uneducated Rakuten-er of the future. But as a question, I think I’ve asked you each of the times that I’ve interviewed you before, which is we have spoken about the things that you can purchase on the platform that you might expect, a pair of Nike shoes, and then other things that maybe you don’t expect, like renting a car. What would you say or what is new about the unexpected things that you can buy on the platform, that is to say what’s the most unexpected thing that you can get on Rakuten that you’d never thought you could?
Dana Marineau (26:14):
That is a great question. Well, you named a couple of them.
“I think people think of Rakuten as apparel and all kinds of clothing and department store. I think people don’t know that you can also get your Uber through Rakuten. You can buy your groceries on Instacart through Rakuten. You can get your ESPN, Hulu deal through Rakuten and buy your plane tickets through Rakuten. And so I do think there are a lot of things that are unexpected. I always am encouraging my friends to go to our feed and play around and discover to see what else we have. So we have everything from Old Navy, to GameStop, to some of the fresh food makers. So I do think nearly, and you joke with me how I only buy at Rakuten, that is true, because there’s nothing that we don’t have that I need for myself, my family, my dogs. So we have it all. So there are really all sorts of unexpected things outside of what people think of us for, which is that retail and apparel.”
— Dana Marineau (26:17)
Adam Conner (27:14):
Well, it sounds like the sky is the limit at least until you start doing consumer space travel. For now, thank you for telling me more about this and also and importantly, what shoppers expect demand at Macy in the future as they develop their fandom with the teams and the players of the sport that is shopping. Dana, thank you so much for joining us and sharing your perspective.
Dana Marineau (27:36):
As always, thanks for having me, Adam.
Adam Conner (27:40):
Thanks again to Dana Marineau from Rakuten for joining us. Hopefully, our conversation opened up a lot of eyes and maybe some wallets as to how to get more from where you shop and thanks to you. Of course, the listener, the wallet opener for exploring the future of Fandom with us and I’d encourage you to stay connected as well. So be sure to subscribe wherever you listen to podcast and, or you can also find all our content at livelike.com and across socials, LinkedIn, a lot of LinkedIn @LiveLike and Twitter @LiveLikeInc. I look forward to predicting the future again with you real soon. And until then I’m Adam Conner saying so long and thanks for being a fan.
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